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 Date: 03/05/2004, 08:42:34
 Posted by: David
 Original URL: Click here (However, the link may be stale.)
 Subject: The bending of reality

There really is no point in confronting middle-aged premies who are fixed in their minds to the point that they will write, and believe all of the following which Carlos has written:

"Peter, M is not and never has been CEO of ANY of the non-profits that back him in his work. He has influence over them, yes, to some degree. But if the picture was as you paint it, following Jimbo's lead (and as a lawyer he should know better; you may have an excuse), then Mata Ji and Bal Bhagwan Ji wouldn't have been able towalk off with all of the properties that they did, back when the split happened. And, yes, since reports of thje things M was doing to try and minimize the Hindhuizing element were widely avai;lable back to at least '73, we ARE responsable, and he IS NOT, for whom we wished to listen to about what he felt, believed, wanted us to understand, etc. Or did you guys in Oz not get the stories we got, like how he said, several times in several ways, that he didn't take his shoes off when he went into ashrams because he'd never felt a need to become an ashram resident to practice K?

There are dozens of other examples. And while the leaders of the non-profits, if they don't get spun off into power trips (and many of us did, and we all had to watch out for it), would try and listen to him and respect his wishes, the further away from him it got the more destorted a message becvame. Ever play that party game, where you all sit in a circle and a mkessage gets written down by the 1st person to whisper it into the ears of the 2nd, who whispers it into the 3rd, and so on? Remember how it ALWAYS becomes unrecognizable when compared to how it started out? So I'm tresponsable if I didn't take that into account about stuff supposedly coming from him. And so are you. And so are all of us."

You cannot argue with the above. It is from another dimension, another universe perhaps. It is the past, warped and bent out of all reckognition. I think Carlos believes what he has written to be the truth and therefore, it is best to ignore it, leave it, move away from it and let it gather dust. One cannot understand the mind of another when it is so different from one's own. It is impossible to comprehend what goes on in some people's minds. It is futile to try.

I once wondered how Glen Whittaker could now talk about Maharaji as a mere teacher when in the early seventies he proclaimed that Maharaji was the Lord God Almighty come in human form. The first headline on the first ever copy of Divine Times read;


Glen showed it off in satsang one night, the first copy to be printed. So it is incomprehensible to me how Glen Whittaker can now bend reality to the point where he sees Maharaji as merely a master. Yet other people have done it and more. People like Carlos will bend and shift reality to the point that it is unreckognisable to most other humans. The only mystery is how they do it so that they believe it themselves.  How they do that, I will never know.

Related link: The Worldwide Forum
Modified by David at Fri, Mar 05, 2004, 08:54:31

 Date: 03/05/2004, 11:50:30
 Posted by: Anna
 Original URL: Click here (However, the link may be stale.)
 Subject: Re: The bending of reality
Hi Dave

Interesting points that you raised here.

Firstly, all the premies that I know (myself included until I became an ex last year) who proclaimed M to be the Lord in the 70's, and who now say that he is just a master or motivational speaker: THEY ARE JUST SAYING THAT!. In their hearts they still believe that M is the lord, but that a different image has to be projected for EV to become acceptable, and look fairly "normal" for the general public.

So they say one thing, but think and believe another. What a surprise - they're not being truthful! Amongst themselves, privately, they acknowledge that M is their Lord. And there's no way they'd all be treking off to India or Amaroo to get darshan if he wasn't - the external (actions speak louder than words) confirmation. Foot kissing. So in a sense, they are not denying it to themselves, they are just being "economical with the truth".

Secondly, "It is impossible to comprehend what goes on in some people's minds. It is futile to try." Yes it is futile to try! To be a premie, and to believe that M is the lord, you do have to suspend reality and objective thinking somewhat! We all did it ourselves, to varying degrees, but now we're out of it we can see it more clearly for what it really was.

I remember at a programme in Brighton, early 90's, a crowd of Christians gathered outside to warn all the premies (in the never ending queue) about false prophets etc. I remember thinking, "If only they knew who M really was!!!" There was no way those Christians could have changed my belief in M&K or could have caused me to even doubt that M was the lord.

What did change the way I thought was finding out the truth about M on EPO. Then I could make an informed decision (although I was very shocked, and it was a painful process at first).

And what I DO find totally incredible, is that when premies discover the real truth about M, how he lives and behaves and treats people. How they can STILL believe he is the Lard is utterly beyond my comprehension. Talk about being in denial!

My one question to premies would be, "Is there ANYTHING, anything at all, that M could do that would make you seriously question your devotion to him?" If the answer is "nothing at all", then this just proves how easy it is to persuade people to delude themselves, and no amount of common sense will get through to that person. They have to understand it for themselves.

That's my understanding so far!


5 Brighter than 1000 suns as seen through night vision goggles
4 As bright as the lights on Maharaji's jet
3 As bright as a 60 watt light bulb
2 As bright as a pile of burning ghi on a swinging arti tray
1 As bright as the inner light as seen by the third eye

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